Philsophy of the Humanities series

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Vlaara, Nov 20, 2017.

  1. Vlaara

    Vlaara Maaruk the Mighty

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    Leiden University:

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLPeStI124dee1ByfcDzRvPxKDNb0GQjmo

    ran into this looking for a good video on Kuhn that was under ten minutes. His three videos didn't fit the bill but the second one covered what I needed covered for the purposes of the discussion I'm hosting today, so I was able to assign only one. The forum wanted me to assign all three, but since I know I would probably only watch one if assigned I only assigned one and it was the most relevant one. However, they were told they could watch the other two if they wished to have a deeper understanding - and if you want an even deeper understanding you should just got a good classical education in addition to whatever temporal shit you learned in college.

    Pretty decent though, probably worth checking out if you want something to listen to while doing whatever.
     
  2. Vlaara

    Vlaara Maaruk the Mighty

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    you guys should really watch this.
     
  3. Velox

    Velox TZT Abuser

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    Can we get a TL;DR?

    EDIT: So this is on logic not Kuhn?

    My impression is that the only good that came out of Kuhn's theories was to remind people that scientists were people too, the rest of it was pretty fuzzy. The whole philosophy of science crowd seems to have spent the last century talking past each other, so I'm not feeling like wasting more time on them.
     
  4. Vlaara

    Vlaara Maaruk the Mighty

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    I'm not giving a TLDR on YouTube videos. You can look and see if Leiden University livetweeted the series. Here is a visual TLDR:

    upload_2017-12-7_7-33-20.png
    upload_2017-12-7_7-33-56.png
    upload_2017-12-7_7-34-50.png
    upload_2017-12-7_7-35-48.png
    upload_2017-12-7_7-36-50.png

    It's just a generally good series on a variety of subjects and it's on the humanities, they are missing some important players and concepts but overall I found it pretty good so far, as you can see I haven't watched them all but I've watched a few of them multiple times as I've not read all these works referenced. 25 videos is a lot, but generally I listen to them while I'm doing something else that doesn't require a lot of concentration. There might be better videos on certain subjects but I did like the ones on Kuhn the best out of all the ones I found on the internet.

    Kuhn's contribution was the concept of paradigm, which was itself a paradigm. It was a lot more than just scientists were human too, but I think that is certainly part of it. It is ironic that the philosophers of science talk past each other, because according to Kuhn that would indicate that they occupy different paradigms. I rec. the book and its concepts to anyone and everyone capable of reading at that level.

    Kuhn was more scientist than philosopher, and scientists are by nature conservative (not in the political sense) and so Kuhn didn't take his ideas and concepts far enough. If you read my culture as paradigm thread, I extend Kuhn's concept and essentially make the claim that the paradigm is the basic framework of human identity.
     
  5. Velox

    Velox TZT Abuser

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    He is famous for the paradigm, but from what I remember, he made pretty strong claims regarding this that were questionable. That is why I said that his main contribution was to remind people that scientists were human too, because the problems he pointed to mirror the rest of society, but the specifics of his paradigm theory are pretty sketchy. E.g. I think he claimed that scientists of different paradigms were unable to communicate due to some vague intrinsic property of paradigms, which is a pretty unscientific and dystopian view of reality.

    You can more easily explain paradigms by observing that humans have limited time/resources to grasp new things, and have vested interests in protecting their view, leading to a natural inertia. Reviewing and funding agencies have similar resource constraints, which further promotes simplification into a changing set of buzzwords, where your research better fit this template or you are unlikely to get funded. That doesn't mean scientists are all stuck in one "paradigm" forever, or necessarily can't understand the usefulness of other paradigms, most will adapt to some extent (unless they are old enough to retire).
     
  6. Vlaara

    Vlaara Maaruk the Mighty

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    Maybe you should reread his work...

    Or I should.
     
  7. Vlaara

    Vlaara Maaruk the Mighty

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    It wasn’t a vague intrinsic property of paradigms at all, it’s because they are operating from a different set of facts and assumptions etc which I thought he made very clear.
     
  8. Velox

    Velox TZT Abuser

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    To be honest I think I've only read second-hand descriptions of his work from others, in that case I should try to find the time to read the source material some time. Although, from what I remember he has written quite a bit over an extended time on this subject, and it allegedly (again second-hand) evolved over time. Once again, a fundamental problem in philosophy is that they often seem to be misrepresenting, or at least, misunderstanding, each other. I've almost given up on the subject.
     
  9. Vlaara

    Vlaara Maaruk the Mighty

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    He did, there is a collection of essays called "The Essential Tension". His thinking began there, and eventually coalesced into the Structure of Scientific Revolutions. There is also "The Road Since Structure" which I have not read.

    Based on my reading all the criticisms I have read of his work had some merit, but not enough to discredit the general theme. It's a pretty good read honestly, I actually enjoyed it enough to re-read it two separate times so it wasn't a slog. I could barely read Hegel and didn't even come close to finishing his work, that shit is a slog. It's not that Hegel is incomprehensible, you just have to read it slowly and carefully. Kuhn is not like that, it was a pretty easy read although apparently also easy to misunderstand unless its me who is misunderstanding him.

    Philosophy pretty unbearable in general, I stick to the classics and have read almost nothing more contemporary than Kuhn. I picked up a book by Popper, but have yet to read it.
     
  10. TulionKT

    TulionKT Spamaton Will Rise Again

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  11. Utumno

    Utumno Administrator Staff Member

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  12. Utumno

    Utumno Administrator Staff Member

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    still lol'ed because that expression
     
  13. AgelessDrifter

    AgelessDrifter TZT Neckbeard Lord

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